Comments on: Commuter Airline Safety; follow the money http://project7alpha.com/2009/05/commuter-airline-safety-follow/ American Airlines in Burma 1942 Mon, 26 Jul 2010 00:47:13 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: Chip http://project7alpha.com/2009/05/commuter-airline-safety-follow/comment-page-1/#comment-160 Chip Wed, 20 May 2009 03:31:49 +0000 http://www.project7alpha.com/?p=444#comment-160 Rick; IATA/FAA know it's coming (shortage); that is what age 65 and MPL are all about. Unfortunately it will be a while before the market forces kicks in. And even then it will take years to catch up. Rick;
IATA/FAA know it’s coming (shortage); that is what age 65 and MPL are all about. Unfortunately it will be a while before the market forces kicks in. And even then it will take years to catch up.

]]> By: Rick http://project7alpha.com/2009/05/commuter-airline-safety-follow/comment-page-1/#comment-159 Rick Tue, 19 May 2009 23:41:23 +0000 http://www.project7alpha.com/?p=444#comment-159 Chip, That was a very informative post. Private pilots like myself don't usually look at data like that. One thing I do know is the market will dictate the salaries. If there becomes a shortage, as it looks like there will, then the pay scales will go up again. I'm a businessman. Market forces always win out eventually. Have a good trip. Chip,
That was a very informative post. Private pilots like myself don’t usually look at data like that. One thing I do know is the market will dictate the salaries. If there becomes a shortage, as it looks like there will, then the pay scales will go up again. I’m a businessman. Market forces always win out eventually. Have a good trip.

]]> By: Chip http://project7alpha.com/2009/05/commuter-airline-safety-follow/comment-page-1/#comment-158 Chip Tue, 19 May 2009 17:55:19 +0000 http://www.project7alpha.com/?p=444#comment-158 Rick; You have to remember that most pilots back in the day learned at the local patch. Those local schools are shuttering their doors. The big schools are survivors do to other revenue streams and the students can get student loans. My second son is currently at one (Central Missouri State); he just soloed the other day. Even the big ones are struggling however, St. Louis Univ. (Parks Air College) alomost shut down their flight program. So the schools you mention are becoming the sole source of pilots. The regionals were getting so desperate just a few years ago, they were flying jets to the schools to recruit. They were hiring kids with 190+ hours (commercial for part 141 school). A new problem in the industry is many of these low time hires do not have the PIC (pilot in command) time to get an ATP (airline transport pilot rating), so they can't upgrade. The military is putting out only a fraction of what it used to. Once the Cold War ended pilot production world wide plummeted. The WWII/Korean/Viet Nam, build ups are all long gone only the VN guys are left. And again the bottom line is nobody in their right mind would leave a 100K job flying Fighters/Bombers/etc, to jerk the gear on a Q-400 for 16K. Even if a military bubba goes to the major airlines, it takes years just to break even financially. The draw of flying the airline "bus" had always been money/schedule, both are long gone. The few that are out there, are going to FEDEX/UPS or South West. Nobody would go to a legacy carrier unless it was a last option. The bottom line is the numbers; check out my post on the pilot shortage then look at the numbers for commercial and ATP. Commercial licences have plummeted while the ATP requirements have significantly raised. That means there will be a shortage as us old guys time out. Gotta go it is pick up time; headed to ORD then home! Rick;
You have to remember that most pilots back in the day learned at the local patch. Those local schools are shuttering their doors. The big schools are survivors do to other revenue streams and the students can get student loans. My second son is currently at one (Central Missouri State); he just soloed the other day. Even the big ones are struggling however, St. Louis Univ. (Parks Air College) alomost shut down their flight program. So the schools you mention are becoming the sole source of pilots.

The regionals were getting so desperate just a few years ago, they were flying jets to the schools to recruit. They were hiring kids with 190+ hours (commercial for part 141 school). A new problem in the industry is many of these low time hires do not have the PIC (pilot in command) time to get an ATP (airline transport pilot rating), so they can’t upgrade.

The military is putting out only a fraction of what it used to. Once the Cold War ended pilot production world wide plummeted. The WWII/Korean/Viet Nam, build ups are all long gone only the VN guys are left. And again the bottom line is nobody in their right mind would leave a 100K job flying Fighters/Bombers/etc, to jerk the gear on a Q-400 for 16K.

Even if a military bubba goes to the major airlines, it takes years just to break even financially. The draw of flying the airline “bus” had always been money/schedule, both are long gone. The few that are out there, are going to FEDEX/UPS or South West. Nobody would go to a legacy carrier unless it was a last option.

The bottom line is the numbers; check out my post on the pilot shortage then look at the numbers for commercial and ATP. Commercial licences have plummeted while the ATP requirements have significantly raised. That means there will be a shortage as us old guys time out.

Gotta go it is pick up time; headed to ORD then home!

]]> By: Rick http://project7alpha.com/2009/05/commuter-airline-safety-follow/comment-page-1/#comment-157 Rick Mon, 18 May 2009 21:02:53 +0000 http://www.project7alpha.com/?p=444#comment-157 Chip, I have waited as much as 45 minutes for a departure at Lafayette, IN while watching more than 30 Purdue flight school students trying to land before a t-storm was coming in. Same thing at the University of North Dakota. With all these pilots being spit out of these big flight schools (e.g. Emory Riddle), I don't think the flow of fresh new candidates for the regionals is going to dry up. The fact that these schools are churning out pilots left and right may be exactly the reason the pay scales are so low. This even before we look at the military as a continuing source of new pilots. Chip,
I have waited as much as 45 minutes for a departure at Lafayette, IN while watching more than 30 Purdue flight school students trying to land before a t-storm was coming in. Same thing at the University of North Dakota. With all these pilots being spit out of these big flight schools (e.g. Emory Riddle), I don’t think the flow of fresh new candidates for the regionals is going to dry up. The fact that these schools are churning out pilots left and right may be exactly the reason the pay scales are so low. This even before we look at the military as a continuing source of new pilots.

]]> By: Chip http://project7alpha.com/2009/05/commuter-airline-safety-follow/comment-page-1/#comment-156 Chip Mon, 18 May 2009 15:55:13 +0000 http://www.project7alpha.com/?p=444#comment-156 Rick; It is the primary concern of mine. However the article details the symtom. The root cause is these pilots are not being paid enough to survive, let alone get prpoer rest. You mis in a schedule that seems designed to fatigue and it's a bad place to be. I'm worried that the regulators will be again guided by the industry and put the onus on the crews through regulation. That will cause no change except that even fewer pilots will enter the profession and the safety issues will go underground. Rick;
It is the primary concern of mine. However the article details the symtom. The root cause is these pilots are not being paid enough to survive, let alone get prpoer rest. You mis in a schedule that seems designed to fatigue and it’s a bad place to be. I’m worried that the regulators will be again guided by the industry and put the onus on the crews through regulation. That will cause no change except that even fewer pilots will enter the profession and the safety issues will go underground.

]]> By: Rick http://project7alpha.com/2009/05/commuter-airline-safety-follow/comment-page-1/#comment-155 Rick Mon, 18 May 2009 13:48:06 +0000 http://www.project7alpha.com/?p=444#comment-155 Chip, Yesterday, Sunday May 17th, the NY Times pubplished an article about regional airline pilots, low pay, long commutes, little rest, sleeping in parking lots or aisles of standing planes. It was very, very disturbing. One lesson I drew from this is never put myself on an evening or night departure. I've always preferred to fly commercially in the morning, and I have now vowed to continue that practice and never get on a late day or night flight. This fatigue issue is a very major topic in my view. Chip,
Yesterday, Sunday May 17th, the NY Times pubplished an article about regional airline pilots, low pay, long commutes, little rest, sleeping in parking lots or aisles of standing planes. It was very, very disturbing. One lesson I drew from this is never put myself on an evening or night departure. I’ve always preferred to fly commercially in the morning, and I have now vowed to continue that practice and never get on a late day or night flight. This fatigue issue is a very major topic in my view.

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